Rune
FESSer
Arr!
Posts: 12
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Post by Rune on Apr 4, 2004 14:21:24 GMT -5
They have no place in traditional mythology. Quick question: What do you consider to be traditional mythology? Norse? Greek? Egyptian? Chinese? Native American? Celtic? Or another culture's? And I'll wait and see with the catgirls. If they have a legitimate reason to be there, I'll leave them alone.
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Post by Guest on Apr 4, 2004 14:41:19 GMT -5
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Post by North2 on Apr 4, 2004 14:45:55 GMT -5
I'm just not seeing the connection that everyone is making in which catgirls represent porn. I don't know about anyone else, but I for one am not aroused by that catgirl one bit. Also, traditional mythology is filled with half-beasts so it's not out of place. In fact, if she was half lion she would fit in extremely well.
Edit: While on Egyptian mythology, I think a certain gigantic rock called the Sphinx would also be included in that.
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TheEnd
FESSer
Seisen no Keifu all the way~
Posts: 1,587
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Post by TheEnd on Apr 4, 2004 14:46:58 GMT -5
Woman with cat head =/= Woman with cat's ears, tail and accent. We're talking about the latter. I wouldn't complain if it just looked like they based in Egyptian Mythology. I don't know about anyone else, but I for one am not aroused by that catgirl one bit. Nor do I. You put an "if" there. In fact, I have complaints against these animal people in FE. They're Breath of Fire's tradition. Not FE's.
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Post by North2 on Apr 4, 2004 15:11:20 GMT -5
Yes, I did put an 'if' in there. And I am willing to bet...my correctness that it will have such a heavy emphasis on 'half-beast' that 'catgirl' would be virtually meaningless in terms of story. Cats and lions have always been tied to 'fast/sensitive/noble/proud creatures' so that could just be part of the story. It can't be a 'doggirl' unless the whole tribe is based on loyalty.
You can't say that it doesn't belong to FE until you play it. If there are people that can turn into dragons, there can surely be half-beasts depending on the story.
P.S. When I said 'catgirl' would be virtually meaningless, I meant the porn aspect of it. The part that she's half cat or lion could have a significant meaning.
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TheEnd
FESSer
Seisen no Keifu all the way~
Posts: 1,587
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Post by TheEnd on Apr 4, 2004 15:20:43 GMT -5
You can't say that it doesn't belong to FE until you play it. I can, as I'm taking as parameter not IS's concept of FE (if such a thing exists), but the one built based on the former FE games, on tradition. Note that I'm not saying it'll suck (and, if I said, I wasn't in my right state of mind). It just doesn't match my concept of "Fire Emblem". Thinking it over, even if animal people belong to egygitian mythology and can be basis for an interesting story, it'd would be something different. Great, maybe. Lovable, maybe. But not fireemblemish. At least, not by nowadays' standards. Yes, I'm talking about purism. And, in such view, myriads of animal men belong in Breath of Fire (not that I dislike BoF, by the way). Maybe these are different from my previous 'reasons'. If they are, just consider I changed my mind.
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Post by North2 on Apr 4, 2004 15:31:05 GMT -5
Well ok, I can understand that much. I have a different feel for 'Fire Emblem' than you though, so I think half-beasts could be a nice addition. I can't be sure yet without playing the game of course.
Just for the record, I think a good majority of Egyptian mythology does not belong in FE at all because it isn't fireemblemish. I do think that half-beasts can be fireemblemish depending on the story, but that's just difference in opinion.
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NeonZ
FESSer
Strike Lord
Posts: 197
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Post by NeonZ on Apr 4, 2004 15:34:40 GMT -5
If Mankoots are still in, I'll be happy.
But if they actually took out mankoots and put these animals in... Then my view about this change will change... A LOT.
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Starwolf
FESSer
Noooo ... I'm oxidising
Posts: 685
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Post by Starwolf on Apr 4, 2004 19:11:06 GMT -5
Mamcoots are still in the game. They just turn into Pheonixes or Lion thingies.
None of you seem to understand the essence of Fire Emblem. This game has upset the essence. It won't feel right and none of you can put a finger on it.
It is all very simple. Il'l take a minute to explain. Fire Emblem has traditionally been very based on Western Mythology/History. The Classes are all things you could expect to see in medievil times from your pantless monks to your paladins. The monsters in these Games are all western based. Look at the Dragons they are the western style of dragon (a mean, lean fighting machine). Fire Emblem Gaiden (and tear ring sagas) Gargoyales, Skeletons and Zombie are all things we can expect in Western horror films.
Very slowly the series has started to twine Eastern influnences into it. The Sword Master and Nomads are examples of this. The whole conceot of the humans with Dragon forms is taken from the kitsune.
But this new Fire Emblkem has made a dramatic leap into eastern. Pheonixes and Nekos show this. Also its story doesn't involve a rich nobleman because the Eastern world doesn't have fighting rich noblemen (in the West noblemen got so much money by basically being army conscripts). Sadly though its retained most of its classes and it doesn't feel right. Pegasus are in Greek mythology for example.
Having too much of something is a spell for disaster look at Zelda the Wind Wakers sea. I don't think this (mostly new) Team Emblem is up to the challenge of doing the classics justice. Their sticking with what works has worked to an extent but now I think they are biting more than they can chew. I'm certain Shouzou Kaga and Gunepi Yoki didn't want it to be like this.
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NeonZ
FESSer
Strike Lord
Posts: 197
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Post by NeonZ on Apr 4, 2004 19:43:59 GMT -5
------ Very slowly the series has started to twine Eastern influnences into it. The Sword Master and Nomads are examples of this. The whole conceot of the humans with Dragon forms is taken from the kitsune.
------ Sword Masters- While The Sword Master is clearly Eastern influenced, it's mainly a personal class created for Navaare-type charachters. Notice that all charachters who have borrowed heavily(or not) from Navaare are in this class.
Also, Dragons turning into humans isn't something that slowly entered in the series, it was there since the first game. -------
But this new Fire Emblkem has made a dramatic leap into eastern. Pheonixes and Nekos show this. Also its story doesn't involve a rich nobleman because the Eastern world doesn't have fighting rich noblemen (in the West noblemen got so much money by basically being army conscripts). Sadly though its retained most of its classes and it doesn't feel right. Pegasus are in Greek mythology for example. ------
Wow! And you got all that because of THREE images and some text? Eastern doesn't have rich noblemen?! Er... haven't you ever heard about Samurais? And how do you know that the story doesn't involve nobles at all? You're assuming too many things...
------ Having too much of something is a spell for disaster look at Zelda the Wind Wakers sea. I don't think this (mostly new) Team Emblem is up to the challenge of doing the classics justice. Their sticking with what works has worked to an extent but now I think they are biting more than they can chew.
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They don't have too much of anything. YOU just said that they were mixing things(Pegasus+Eastern influences).
People! Calm down! You're being too harsh! I can't believe how you're acting because of so few screen shots... I mean... these are various assumptions I've seem in these boards, all of them treated almost as facts by the ones who posted:
1-There will be no dragons at all. 2-There will be a race of catgirls. 3-There will be no nobles in this game. 4-The attack animation is seen from an overhead view.(There's one shot which IS NOT overhead, and this shot had more info and stats than the overhead one.)
Don't you think you're assuming too much from the small info we have?
Also... Wind Waker is my favorite Zelda ;D
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Post by Ryrokos on Apr 4, 2004 20:08:13 GMT -5
There was a game that was part of a very famous series, and everyone was doubting it because it was going to be against the tradition. People were saying that the development team couldn't pull it off, that the change to 3D was going to destroy that game and ruin the series for new players and veterans alike.
Have any of you nay-sayers ever played Metroid Prime? Certainly not the same changes, in terms of theme and characterisation, but nonetheless it was under siege by a small army of doubting veterans.
A thing I don't understand is that some of you people appear to be content to play the same old game for all eternity, just as long as it's presented differently. The overwhelming sentiment that this game "won't live up to the past games" or "will ruin all that is good and Fire Emblem" is sensationalist, short-sighted, simpleton logic that if you applied on a broader sense would keep the world back in the stone ages.
Fire Emblem has always possessed a rich Medieval flair, and in no way has this been diminished with this leatest installment. The character art simply annihilates anything seen so far in terms of official art. The Grypon and Lion shapeshifters are what I believe to be a different take on the traditional Mamkute classes. I don't understand why not myself - Gryphons have forever been popular in Medieval mythology, and the Lion was an incredibly popular image as well.
I might not be a 'veteran' around here, but I fully well understand what the essence of Fire Emblem is in my mind. As long as its a character driven game, rich in medieval flair in which a ragtag army overcomes all the odds to stick it to an evil Empire, King or Ancient Race by using a few dusty holy weapons and liberal use of the reset button if you're unfortunate enough to have someone die. Most of all, just by seeing a few screenshots, I know that this game will capture all that and much more.
This rank idiocy over this single 'catgirl' bringing on Fire Emblem's END TIMES is astounding to me. I'm going to stake my bet early on, and say that the only END TIMES this game will accomplish is making the old games look dated, shallow and obsolete - and that's what I'm sure a lot of people are thinking but aren't saying.
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Post by Kayci on Apr 4, 2004 20:08:50 GMT -5
I'm against the catgirls for right now, but my reasons aren't going to be half as eloquent as a lot of people's.
One of the main reasons that I liked Blazing Sword so much when I started to play it was because it felt like the books that I like to read. I have no problem with mythical creatures- dragons, pegasii, rocs, and pretty much anything else- but I've never liked cross-species. A dragon in human form I can accept, because they're still dragons, with a different appearance. Half-breeds (like Sofiya, for instance) are fine with me, too- she doesn't have a long tail and scales sprouting out of her neck. If the catgirl was half-feline, but looked human, I probably wouldn't have a problem with it- just as long as her mother/father was able to take human form.
I've only played the last four Fire Emblem games, so I don't have as much of a sense of tradition as a lot of people do, but I still say that it's a branch away from what they were doing, as if they're trying to mimic some other games that have been successful (just an opinion, mind you).
The catgirls and winged men might be good, they might be bad. But they're going to have to be really good for me to like them- I don't like new things all that often.
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Post by GreenShyguy on Apr 4, 2004 20:26:11 GMT -5
I don't see why everyone is so adamantly opposed to cat girls. Whoever said cat girls don't necessarily have to be associated with hentai is right. After all, there is a cat girl character in Breath of Fire 2, and I don't recall any hentai, or anything remotely close to it, in that game.
I'd like to see some more fantasy elements: different races, mixed breeds, more monsters, etc. One army of humans vs. another army of humans is going to get old eventually.
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Miracle of the Blue Flame
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Post by Miracle of the Blue Flame on Apr 4, 2004 20:37:57 GMT -5
Ryrokos' post summed it up in a nutshell for me. I too am no veteran when it comes to playing Fire Emblem. Heck, I've only played FE7, but I know a lot about the other ones from reviews and discussions on them here. So I think I can say that the Fire Emblem series is diverse from other games because of its special qualities.
But I find that this new game has sparked my interest in the series greatly because it is so different from what I've seen. What attracts me to it is, in fact, the new half-beast races that have appeared(ex.catgirl), its 3D, and the main character isn't a nobleman. Change seems to attract me and it also seems to upset most of the Fire Emblem fans.
I am not dissing the other games when I say all this. I only want to share my perspective of the series with this addition. I really want to play the other games too and pray that Nintendo will bring the other games to the states.
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Post by GreenShyguy on Apr 4, 2004 20:39:51 GMT -5
So? Who says the game has to be based on traditional mythology? Why can't a game have its own?
After all, it is a video game set in a ficticious world.
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